Letter to the Editor: Dedham Square Project
"I don’t see this project as an improvement to get people to come to the square. I see it as a deterrent."
Dear Editor,
I have been watching this Dedham Square project unfold and as I see some of the changes, I have to beg the question... Did any intelligent, rational thought even go into this plan?
I want to see the shops get more business. We’re all for small business, but does anyone really think bigger sidewalks in a square that already has traffic pitfalls and back ups is the way to go?
Let me start with that extended sidewalk in front of the police station. Before, rush hour traffic would be backed up with commuters coming from High Street, or the Needham Area, with 3 lanes in front of the police station.
Now you have one lane, and many people catch Washington Street there. So without the option of being able to go around the folks going left, the traffic is going to be backed up worse.
What was a 30 minute commute could turn in 45 minutes to an hour to get to and go through the square. I would love to meet the person that is going to want to shop in the square after going through that mess. Commuters are going to get frustrated and start using the quiet Upper Dedham side streets and then those folks are going to be upset by increased traffic.
The next foolish idea is going on across from Centre Deli and the shops in that area. The plan is to have diagonal parking across the street. So now we’re going to have folks backing out of spaces on High Street? This is absolutely maddening. At least on Washington Street there is plenty of room to have that kind of parking. So folks who have to sit for almost an hour to get through the square now have to deal with folks trying to back out of spaces on the other end? Again, where is the rational thought process here? Was there ever one?
I hear family members and friends complain about folks not stopping for pedestrians in the crosswalks. The square before this project was frustrating to navigate. How likely are drivers going to be to let pedestrians cross when they have to sit in backed up traffic longer to get through the square? I’m going to guess this problem also gets worse.
I don’t see this project as an improvement to get people to come to the square. I see it as a deterrent. I will not be coming to the square as often once this is completed and it’s lousy because I love the coffee at Mocha Java, The food at Centre Deli, I enjoy occasionally going to Dedham Community Theatre and Dedham Flower Shoppe. I just won’t be frequenting these places as often because they are in the square and the town made it more impossible for me to come here.
I have a bad feeling that this project aimed at helping improve business in the square may ultimately hurt these businesses because navigating the square will be harder. And I think people will be even more frustrated coming there then they already are. I just don’t think any of these pitfalls with driving were planned for. I think the town just decided to make the square more attractive, but didn’t look at all of the logistics. What happens when we get snow? This square is going to be a nightmare to drive through.
I’m probably writing what many other folks are already thinking. Was this voted on? I don’t recall this ever being presented for a vote, but I could be wrong. I seriously can’t see the town voting on this. I’m sorry, but I simply do not think any intelligence went into this plan nor was there a rational thought. So my tax dollars are being used to deter me from going to the square. Isn’t this wonderful? Thanks Dedham.
I am a huge supporter of this town and it annoys me to no end when we do foolish things like this and people from other towns that I know laugh at us when we do these nonsensical things. I’m personally disappointed in this project and will be frequenting the square a lot less.
Thanks
Dan O’Neil
Eileen Kelly
9:26 am on Thursday, August 16, 2012
Dan, I have seen every plan and have been to many of the planning meetings. I don't know where the idea of parallell parking across from Centre Deli is coming from. The design engineers worked very hard on this project. Any time there is construction on our streets or in our home it is frustrating and scary. We as a community voted for this project. Stirring up negativity half way through is not helping this situation. If you truly want the shops to benefit then you should consider keeping an open mind know that we, the shop owners,in the square appreciate your patience
Telling it like it is
10:05 am on Friday, August 17, 2012
How exactly is pointing out the obvious negetive? I come home 5 days aweek through the center via High street. It takes FOREVER now. From 3 lanes to 1, how shortsighted. That is why I now use Village ave. as my cut thru. Can't wait till the 1% try to declare it a private way.
Dan O'Neil
10:01 am on Thursday, August 16, 2012
The parrallel parking thing came from shop owners. Are you changing the stop light in the square to allow left turns? If not good luck commuting from Needham or Rt.109 or even coming through from the other end. I'm sure the folks on Village Ave will be so happy to see more traffic going by there $600,000+ homes every day. Here's the thing. I'm not being negative. I'm being real. I have a lot of nice things to say about this town and I also thing there are a lot of things wrong. Taking the option of going around someone going left and backing up traffic and annoying people is wrong. I already sat in it. It's a nightmare. Why do you think I wrote the letter. I'm sure planning the project did take a lot of effort, but did you people plan for traffic flow? So far it doesn't. Believe me I have had this conversation with about 30 or 40 residents and they don't even know how the plan makes this a better situation. I'm the only one willing to say this is a bad plan. Not to be mean, not to be spiteful, because I care and because I care enough to speak my mind when I see something that just doesn't make sense. This doesn't make sense.
Lisa Mullinix
10:24 am on Thursday, August 16, 2012
I haven't been follow the planning stages of the "mess" in the square, but I do have a question. Why couldn't they put a 2 story parking garage in the parking lot area? It seems that would alleviate a lot of the parking issues in the square.
Dan O'Neil
12:45 pm on Thursday, August 16, 2012
Lisa, that is an idea that makes complete sense and I have thought that myself. A lot of the traffic trouble is people trying to park on the street. That is another pitfall to the plan. A garage like legacy has even on a smaller scale would open up a lot of that. The plan they have in place does increase that lot by about 15 or 20 spaces, but with the increased sidewalks how many street spaces are we losing? I'm not against the square looking more attractive. I actually think making it handicap accessable is terrific, but I think traffic is the thing that wasn't really in the plan even if you change a traffic light.
james
12:20 am on Wednesday, August 22, 2012
To suggest that no thought went into the planning of this project is insulting. Several town officials and community leaders, many of whom volunteered their time, collectively spent hundreds of hours developing plans for the Square Project. There were over 30 public meetings at which the project was discussed and residents had an opportunity to offer input and ask questions about the plans. These meetings were advertised in the local papers and online. There was ample opportunity for you to challenge the plans and ask questions but I'm guessing you don't read the local papers since you are obviously very misinformed. Articles on these meetings appeared in all of the local news outlets.. It's easier to sit in front of your keyboard and discredit and criticize the process and the decisions made after the fact. Unless you are an experienced traffic engineer and can offer any educated commentary on what "makes sense" then you're just offering your opinion based on observations. Do you know better than a team of engineers who spent hundreds of hours studying the traffic patterns in the Square, the parking, the unsafe crosswalks, among other things? Before ranting and raving that the Square Project is a horrible mistake and a waste of money while claiming to be a "huge supporter of this town", do your homework. Your letter is riddled with inaccuracies. Yes the project was voted on - at 2011 town meeting. I guess you missed the front page articles in the local paper.
Lisa Mullinix
1:01 pm on Thursday, August 16, 2012
The whole parking/traffic issue in front of the police station is a mess already. Can you imagine when it finished and down to one lane. I live in Riverdale and travel to other parts of town via Route 95 now, just to avoid the square. If I do go thru the square area it can take me as much as 20 minutes to get to the Endicott area of town. Its sad, just plain sad.
Dan O'Neil
1:57 pm on Thursday, August 16, 2012
I agree. I saw the plan and they are putting a left arrow light in, but even with that you have to account for traffic flow from 4 directions so that light is not going to be green for as long. It will still be a rough go in the morning and at rush hour. Imagine working in the Needham/Wellesley area and coming home at 5. It's gonna be a rough time for folks. I mispoke in my letter. I think refurbishing the square is great. i just don't think you need to enlarge sidewalks and make less driving room to do it. If the traffic is going to make people avoid the square how do the shops succeed? That's my issue.
Jen Craven
10:17 pm on Thursday, August 16, 2012
When the project is finished there will be two eastbound lanes in front of the police station not one. The traffic light in the center of the square which is the cause of most of the backup will be gone. I agree that the parallel parking in that spot seems to be a bad idea but who knows, there's still much work to be done. I do like the idea of a parking garage in the town lot but I guess it's to late for that. I think many of the square circle thing Dedham Square is going to become Newbury Street or something of the like. Sorry but that's never going to happen, there aren't many exciting places in Dedham Square, just a fact.
Dan O'Neil
10:38 pm on Thursday, August 16, 2012
Jen, that is true. The theatre is a great place. Paul made that place more profitable than anybody would have thought. Having more places with liquor licenses also helps. Centre Deli/Deli after dark is a great night spot and great during the day. Mocha Java is nice, if you have small kids the Blue Bunny is an excellent store, outside of that you're right they want the square to be something it simply isn't. Do I want to see us take pride in the square? Absolutely I do. I just think there needs to be a little more reality and a little more common sense. Sprucing up the sidewalks and making the sidewalks handicap accsessable are great improvements and I'm all for that and also for having the new lights and the trees. My issue is you could do all of those things with out enlargening the sidewalks. I could see maybe 6 inches without the giant curbs on the corners. I think some of this stuff is just too drastic for a small town square. Again not being mean about it simply being real.
james
12:28 am on Wednesday, August 22, 2012
Want to make the Square something it isn't? A safer, more attractive place with more parking that people are more interested in visiting? And a place that will attract new businesses and tax revenue? What a crazy idea. We are so lucky to have you on retainer to help us keep it "real". We could end up with a really amazing and thriving downtown, and then where would we all be? Thanks for looking out for us, Dan.
Jen Craven
10:54 pm on Thursday, August 16, 2012
I agree Dan, the huge sidewalks are a bit surprising and I do think that maybe just fixing the old sidewalks and getting rid of that foolish traffic light could have been a better way to go. Whatever the plan is in front of and next to the police station I don't know, but it looks like the police lost a few parking spots already. I'm hoping that whoever made this plan was smarter then me , most likely they were, and knew what they were doing. just wondering when the 1st car will crash over the giant, jutting curbs that have narrowed the intersection.
Noreen
6:04 pm on Saturday, August 18, 2012
I also don't like the layout in front of the police station. Wait until the winter when the plows are trying to plow that stretch of the street. Good luck with that! I was in the center on Sat. and many of the patrons I ran into were commenting on the project and all were negative. Just letting you know that more people are against it than for it. I just hope the engineers have something in mind that we have yet to see. So far, I'm not very impressed. I'm also against the wide sidewalks. I just don't think they were necessary. Really to bad because the square in a quaint place to visit and I think this project will change all that.
james
12:34 am on Wednesday, August 22, 2012
So Noreen, you have conducted your own scientific poll and have surmised that more people are against it than they are for it? Interesting, because of all the people I have spoken to about it, the overwhelming majority are in favor of it. I visit Mocha Java regularly and talk to friends, neighbors, acquaintances and Square employees who are really excited about the project. Yes, everyone agrees that construction is a huge inconvenience but that it's necessary to get to the end result. Misery loves company so I'm sure the negative nellies who think the project is a bad idea find each other and have a field day bitching about the traffic and every other negative thing they can find with the project. I prefer to hang with the positive pollies who can see the forest for the trees.
Dan O'Neil
9:40 pm on Saturday, August 18, 2012
They are trying to make the square somthing it simply isn't. This isn't Newbury Street or some yuppyesque place it is a small town square.
Gary Roberts
11:53 pm on Saturday, August 18, 2012
Unlike towns such as Natick, we don't have a green area for people to relax and walk in while enjoying the town center. So what's to attract browsers to Dedham Square? Seems to me a handful of shop owners have pushed the changes through for their own benefit with the idea that If They Build It All Will Come. No green space to sit and relax, no shade trees, just sidewalks, cars and a handful of shops next door to the various malls and Legacy Place. I think this is an instance of hubris instead of reality at work.
james
12:47 am on Wednesday, August 22, 2012
Very disappointing comments from you, Gary. And to think I voted for you when you ran for Library Trustee. For the record, a "handful of shop owners" didn't push the changes through for their own benefit. To suggest that the project was pushed through because of "hubris" is just ridiculous. There was a large cross-section of residents from very precinct in town that were major advocates for this project, myself included (and just for the record, I don't live in Precinct 1). These are the same people who attended the public hearings and offered input and feedback on the plans. These are the hearings that apparently Dan O'Neil wasn't aware of. Apparently you haven't taken the time to read up on the plans for the project. The wider sidewalks will help to attract more pedestrians (don't take my word for it - there is plenty of research that supports this). And guess what??? There are going to be TREES planted in the Square - and lots of them! Hundreds of trees and plantings. It would be so refreshing if people would do their homework before sharing information that isn't accurate.
.
Dan O'Neil
6:06 am on Wednesday, August 22, 2012
James, I'm going to retort. I read about the project. I'm not against the square looking nicer, but here's the rub. I'm gonna use an example here. Not sure if your a Celtics fan, but they had shirts that said, "I am not Hollywood." and "I am not South Beach." well "I am not Newbury Street!" and neither is Dedham. It just isn't. Smaller streets equals more traffic. It just does. I also did refer to the fact thst I wasn't sure if it was voted on. I made that very clear. Again, that;s not negative it's . The last time i checked I lived in the real world. Unless you're from upper dedham or right near the square you are not walking just to go to the square, you're going to drive and if you drive and it's aggrivating to navigate the smaller streets in the square are you shopping? Again, real not negative. The wide sidewalks are a bad ides. The other stuff, much of it can be done without that and the square would still be attractive. Ugh 2 steps forward 3 steps back as always in this town. Never changes.
Telling it like it is
8:35 am on Wednesday, August 22, 2012
James, you are so passionate on the subject. No one seems to have done their homework, but you of coarse.
My guess is your a cop. Who see's this project as an endless stream of details. Where the "money grab" just keeps on rolling. Remember, never kill the job.
So many holes. So many details.
james
9:35 am on Wednesday, August 22, 2012
Nope, not a cop, sorry to disappoint. And I'm not a Dedham "lifer" either. Just a tax-paying citizen who landed in town many years ago and have been encouraged and impressed by the positive change I've seen around town over the last several years. It's a free country and everyone is certainly entitled to their opinions. I just find it frustrating when misinformation is shared and packaged in an 'opinion' that does nothing but get people riled up.
Dan O'Neil
6:19 am on Wednesday, August 22, 2012
"Jen, that is true. The theatre is a great place. Paul made that place more profitable than anybody would have thought. Having more places with liquor licenses also helps. Centre Deli/Deli after dark is a great night spot and great during the day. Mocha Java is nice, if you have small kids the Blue Bunny is an excellent store, outside of that you're right they want the square to be something it simply isn't. Do I want to see us take pride in the square? Absolutely I do. I just think there needs to be a little more reality and a little more common sense. Sprucing up the sidewalks and making the sidewalks handicap accsessable are great improvements and I'm all for that and also for having the new lights and the trees. My issue is you could do all of those things with out enlargening the sidewalks. I could see maybe 6 inches without the giant curbs on the corners. I think some of this stuff is just too drastic for a small town square. Again not being mean about it simply being real." - James is so smart he didn't read here where I'm all for handicap access which does make safer and I also mentioned stores in a good light and said I agreed with some of the changes, but because I hate traffic I don't know anything. James, aggrivated people who go through stress driving through the square don't want to stop, look at trees and shop, they just don't.
Eileen Kelly
8:50 am on Wednesday, August 22, 2012
I think this is getting a little silly. This was not pushed through by a handful of people in the square. This issue went through extensive open informational meetings before going before town meeting. It was voted for. I went to the meetings and there were changes made in the plans because of concerns. It was all very open and forthright. No one is trying to be Newbury Street, but for sure, Dedham deserves a decent center of town. You can not attract business to a depressed downtown. The area had not been improved in over 50 years. Dedham is a beautiful, historic town. You can complain all you want. This is America, but please ask the proper people, get your facts straight before you spout to the newspapers. The job manager has an office in the location where Cheeky Diva used to be. (the building this town bought at the same town meeting where we voted on the square improvement project) They have an open door policy. Instead of trying to incite an angry mob mentality ,Why don't you ask questions, and then make informed decisions about what you think.
Dan O'Neil
9:05 am on Wednesday, August 22, 2012
Eileen, this is what people think. I'm not starting any mobs. My letter went to the times before I submitted it here. I've lived here for over 30 years. I've seen it all. I don't have to ask questions I already know the answer too. I read the info on the project. I never said the square shouldn't look better and BTW the square isn't a depressed downtown. Could it use some sprucing up? Yes. Could we make it more attractive and handicapped friendlly? Of course we can? Can we do it without making the square hard to navigate? Yes. why couldn't we. That's the whole point. That's where you not me are being norrow minded on this thing. You can do all the things you are planning without these giant curbs and sidewalks. That's the issue. Also how many spaces on the street are we losing? Does it equal the ones we gained in the lot? That wasn't mentioned, but maybe like not knowing there was a vote I simply didn't see that. Like I said 2 steps forward 3 steps back.
Lisa Mullinix
10:00 am on Wednesday, August 22, 2012
James, I do have a question that possibly you can answer. I did not attend any meeting, but am curious.....was a parkng garage mentioned and if so what was the reason for not putting it in? I am sure they must have thought of it throughout the planning stages and I am sure there is a legitimate reason for not putting one in, I just cant think of it.